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The way I read this skill, and here�s where nitpicking becomes important:
"The Barbarian is kept alive" (emphasis mine) means that he doesn�t die at all. No corpse, no death effects, just your health bubble goes up, and you keep at it. Think of it as if, as soon as you hit 0 HP, the game feeds you a rejuvenation potion, and you keep going. If you�re surrounded by monsters, you�ll die again, and soon. In PVP, it simply means that you�ll have a bit of a respite, and for all intents and purposes an extra 30% life that comes into play once you reach 0 life.
I'm pretty sure this is what they meant too. Hmm, when it's worded that way, it sounds like it simply adds to your max health under certain conditions. It doesn't sound like this skill is a problem then.|||I disagree with Throndhart's reasoning, and others who are saying, 'you'll likely die again anyway if you're in a jam'. I don't see how a player would die again. Wouldn't they just run the hell out of there? That is the smart thing to do. If they get killed and pop back with 30% health, why would they stick around in that mob? What they were doing got them killed; therefore, they won't make that mistake again. They'll run way the hell back to the area where the monsters are cleared out. They'll jam a potion into them while they're escaping the mob, too.
30% of your health as a barb is quite a lot. Many HC players won't take on a mob if the mob can drop his health by 30% in 2-3 hits. That is too risky. So in a d3 scenario, let's say they get killed due to inattention or a miniboss blows up. Their life bulb then goes up to 30%. A bunch of monsters then hit them 'because they're surrounded by monsters'. They hit the barb 6-8 times while the barb runs the hell out of there. His orb goes down A LITTLE BIT from those 6-8 hits. Otherwise, if those 6-8 hits took the life orb down to something frightfully low, the player would see that he's not palying HC right. He'll pump more into life gear/life skills or simply fight weaker stuff untill he can handle 6-8 hits at 30% life with no worries. They certainly wouldn't get killed by the same mob twice in a row.
"Think of it as if, as soon as you hit 0 HP, the game feeds you a rejuvenation potion, and you keep going." But Throndhart, if that happened to anyone's chr, there'd be hardly anyone dead on HC. Many of us would just love for a rejuv to be fed to us just before we die. To me, it sounds A BIT like the chicken program because it uses super-fast AI to do the 'rejuv' clicking faster than we could do it at that 100% perfect time. It's just rejuv instead of tping to town. This sort of thing would rescue us form hundreds of deaths on HC mode, making HC less scary.
Part of the challenge fo HC (and thrill) is knowing the health orb and when you need to panic. I guess we don't need to panic ever again because a 1-5% full life orb (darn near invisible and empty) = 30% full health orb. No worries.
Note: I think Malificent is right in his deciphering; The "t", when looking at other t's, just happens to be shorter than we normally expect form normal text.|||Feel free to disagree with me. I�ve had the whole "2-3 hits and you�re dead again" happen to me often, specially on very nasty boss mods, like an Extra Strong, Fire Enchanted, Conviction aura boss, but I don�t play hardcore cos I don�t like it, find it a time sink. The main point of my point isn�t whether it lessens HC or not, or whether it�s balanced or not (only seeing the skill in action will tell), but pointing out the way that I think the ability is going to work, in order to give people a (at least in my opinion) more accurate idea of what to expect.|||Quote:
A variation on the concept of the skill could be very interesting. The skill is not an inherently overpowered one but the implementation appears to be weak regardless, due to potentially allowing f. Self ressurection is a sensational and inaccurate description of a buff skill that is similar, but probably very much inferior (we don't yet know the value of healing), to one that boosts maximum life by 30% (perhaps going up to 100% at higher levels).
A far better - more intensive, more skilled, high risk/reward - version of this skill would be if it was a very short duration active buff, e.g. 2 seconds, with short cast time, and a far lower cooldown such as 15 seconds. In this way it could be a potentially very effective - but dangerous (if the buff drops a frame too soon or you hit the skill a tiny bit too late, you're dead!) - skill-orientated self heal that doesn't risk resulting in significently slower paced play (players in HC fighting only while this skill is active and going afk otherwise, anyone?). This implementation could also make for some very interesting mind games in pvp.
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People in this thread are getting totally hung up purely over the semantics to the point they'd probably glance over a 'halves all damage skill' in favour of fixating on this rather mediocre skill simply due to the inclusion resurrect in the description. BO is so, so much more broken than this skill.
I will note one thing I didn't mention in the other thread on this skill; it protects from attacks that do any amount of instant damage. This shouldn't matter - the officially stated design direction is towards a greater focus on attrition which has been made a possible threat by the reduction potion spam and likely tps - only if significent bugs make it to release along the lines of some of D2's (extra strong FE, FE mummies, multiple element enchanteds, tomb vipers) or imba bosses (1.07 meph's cold orb, 1.07 baal's breath attack) would this be a disproportionately valuable skill to HC players. Which is unlikely; Blizz aren't the company they were when D2 was made and extensive beta-testing is very likely to iron out these threats (half the examples I've given this skill wouldn't help against btw, at least not as much as a very low BO).|||* You assume that 'taking 6-8 hits at 30% life' will happen again in D3. In D1 6-8 hits by anything just killed you.
* Of course you can run out of there, but if you just cast low level BO which gives you 30% more life, you can also run out of there when you run out of natural life. Death Proof is pretty much the same as a low level BO with the caveat that it only works once every 300 seconds.|||You still have to cast the BO...
The issue with DP is that it works with 100% efficiency as of right now when your health reaches 0 (1?). Sure, they can make this balanced. But I'd rather they think of something else.|||BO works with 100% efficiency 100% of the time.
DP works with 100% efficiency once every 6 minutes.
BO works with your entire party, and increases their mana to boot.
Deathproof is still no where close to how good Battle Orders is, even if you have to take the "inconvenience" of casting it every 4-5 minutes.
*Plus, take a look at this skill from the Juggernaut Tree:
# Passive Skill
# Max Rank: 15
# Description: Whenever the Barbarian is below 50% health, all damage is reduced by X%.
* Rank 1: Damage is reduced by 21%.
* Rank 2: Damage is reduced by 34%.
Depending on percentage, this will be on several orders of magnitude better than Death Proof.
Even at rank 2, it effectively increases your HP by 50% as soon as you get knocked below 50%. Let's be conservative and that over 15 ranks it will reduce damage by 50%. Your effective HP gets doubled once you hit 50%. Let's go wild and assume it goes to 75% damage reduction. Your effective HP gets quadrupled when you go below half. That would mean that a 1k HP barbarian would effectively have 2.5k HP with this skill maxed. That is comparable to a what, 40 total skill points Battle Orders in terms of HP increase? Not nearly as good as BO in terms general utility (no mana, stamina, and party increase), but miles better than Death Proof, at lower tree position (meaning every Barbarian can max this at any point they wish.|||Quote:
BO works with 100% efficiency 100% of the time.
No it doesn't... it's a ****ing spell... unless you cast it it doesn't work. DP works all the time. That's the problem.
You don't need to pay attention with DP.
The Juggernaut skill will be balanced against. Those extra 50% are not going to be given to you for free. DP really doesn't need to be balanced against. And if it will be, I don't welcome it. I don't like chars being balanced based on having a spell that saves them from death.|||Omg, did you just say BO is weak because you have to cast it?
The only problem with Death Proof is the stupid Tarantino pun, other than that it's well balanced. You die, you respawn with 30% life a few moments later, you die again to the exact same mob. Whoo.|||Quote:
No it doesn't... it's a ****ing spell... unless you cast it it doesn't work. DP works all the time. That's the problem.
You don't need to pay attention with DP.
If you play a Barbarian, keeping BO on is like breathing to you. I haven't seen a single Barbarian beyond level 50 in Diablo 2 that had the skill and didn't keep it up 100% as a reflex. It's not exactly a monumental task of concentration and attention to keep it up permanently. In fact, it takes more concentration to pay attention to DP because it's guaranteed to not work for 6 minutes after it gets used.
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The Juggernaut skill will be balanced against. Those extra 50% are not going to be given to you for free. DP really doesn't need to be balanced against. And if it will be, I don't welcome it. I don't like chars being balanced based on having a spell that saves them from death.
Why would Blizzard balance an entire class based on a skill that only works every 6 minutes and is functionally identical to a shield block followed by a heal? Do you really think they expect every Barbarian that took this skill to just stop playing for 6 minutes every time it gets used to wait for the cooldown to flush?
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The only problem with Death Proof is the stupid Tarantino pun, other than that it's well balanced. You die, you respawn with 30% life a few moments later, you die again to the exact same mob. Whoo.
That's assuming there even is a respawn. The way it's worded implies that it will do nothing more than replace character death with an x% heal, meaning there is literally nothing stopping an attack following the killing blow by .001 seconds ripping you a new one.
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